Gun or shells

[-DIRTNAP-]

With tss high pellet count. Why pay high dollar for guns. I can remember the hevi 7 days trying to get 300 in the 10 at 40. I think mossbergs won. Question is I think every gun shoots tss well. What makes some folks pay high dollar for guns do the high dollar guns actually pattern better. Why does the m2 get the praise in 20 gauge? Is it the shells or the gun?

[Hobbes_mobile]

I guess I don't own anything high dollar, but it's a relatively simple answer......... reliability. Junk is junk no matter how good a pattern it throws. If it won't go bang without fault whenever you need it to, the pattern doesn't much matter. With that said, I mostly own what some folks would call junk.

[ol bob]

Whether it cost $200 or $2000 a shotgun is nothing more than a pipe with a stock on it.

[Southern Sportsman]

M2s are popular because benellis are well built and will last a lifetime. For turkey guns, many use a Francchi Affinity as a cheaper alternative for an inertia gun. But generally, people aren’t buying a particular gun for the pattern.

[-DIRTNAP-]

Some guns offer chrome lined, or back bored, or lengthened forcing cone...etc. guessing none of that Matters

[Spuriosity]

There is a certain pride in ownership of something that is well made and will last virtually forever. But you are correct, TSS shoots well in about anything.

[WV Ridge Reaper]

Reliability is what I base my gun buys on..My one m2 has been drop,used as a beatin club,throwed,and ran over once..goes bang when I pull the trigger!

[Hognutz]

Chevette or Corvette. Your choice.

[Hobbes_mobile]

Whether it cost $200 or $2000 a shotgun is nothing more than a pipe with a stock on it.

The difficulty comes in consistently feeding a shell into the pipe under any conditions. The trigger and firing pin works are pretty important too.

I've owned at least one pump shotgun that wouldn't feed shells worth a dang (Weatherby), one auto that required a replacement spring because the original sucked and it wouldn't reliably eject and feed light loads ( S&W). Both of those guns were in the 80s. Some of that probably doesn't matter a lot while turkey hunting unless you need a second shot. With that said, my moderately priced Remington pumps and autos have all been reliable. The auto is probably the cheapest made of them and the newest. It's definitely not the 1100 that I grew up with but it's their cheapest model and I got a good price on it used.

[-DIRTNAP-]

the m2 and the franchi have feeding problems with tss. i get what you guys are saying but buying a shotgun before tss you looked deeper into barrel improvements and getting them to shoot better. we had deep cleaning, lengthened forcing cone, barrel porting, back boring, trying a stack of aftermarket tubes. im guilty of it myself think i have a sink hole out back from all the hevishot bb trying to get that junk to pattern. every gun i seen try tss shoots really good. im just saying getting hard for gun manufacturers to sell high dollar guns to make you feel like your buying a better pattern. benelli super black eagle close to 2 grand. browning maxus around 1500. stevens 301 around 250 and probable same pattern at 50

[GLS]

The most I've spent on acquiring a turkey shotgun since 2012 was $150 for a Yildiz TK12. In 2012 I spent $95 and $10 shipping with Cheaper Than Dirt for an MP18 20 ga. Baikal. The same year I bought a TK36 .410 from Academy for $130. Customizing and gunsmithing for screw-in chokes and red dot bases drove expenses up, but maybe with all three totaled to about 1/4 of the price of the cost of my SBE which hit the road in a trade for a SXS shotgun. I have thoroughly enjoyed the process of modifying and owning an inexpensive and reliable single-shot perform as well as a $2000 auto on the first shot with the added features of significant weight reduction and ease of carry. I'd rather have a $130 new single-shot customized and 20 pounds of TSS than a $2000 SBE and depend on WallyWorld or another big box store for shotgun shells at $10 a box. For pride of ownership of a shotgun which I understand, I expend that on my SXS shotguns that I use for quail and woodcock over my Brittanys. Gil

[pullit]

For me I want something that is dependable and that will last. I have been in too many pheasant and duck hunting trips where I send my down time trying to fix other peoples cheap guns so they can hunt. I usually tell them "buy once and cry once".

[howl]

A lot of turkeys fall before people using calls they bought at walmart. I wouldn't touch one. Some people pay literal thousands for a call and actually hunt it. Tap the brim and carry on.

[HuntSource]

the m2 and the franchi have feeding problems with tss. i get what you guys are saying but buying a shotgun before tss you looked deeper into barrel improvements and getting them to shoot better. we had deep cleaning, lengthened forcing cone, barrel porting, back boring, trying a stack of aftermarket tubes. im guilty of it myself think i have a sink hole out back from all the hevishot bb trying to get that junk to pattern. every gun i seen try tss shoots really good. im just saying getting hard for gun manufacturers to sell high dollar guns to make you feel like your buying a better pattern. benelli super black eagle close to 2 grand. browning maxus around 1500. stevens 301 around 250 and probable same pattern at 50

What problems are you referencing regarding the M2 and Franchi with feeding with TSS? The only issue I'm aware of is trying to use roll crimped 3" shells that are finished longer than industry specification. If you fold crimp or ensure roll crimp shells are the right length, then there're zero problems. I've used M2s and Vincis, which have 3" chambers, for a decade now with TSS and nary a fail to cycle.

Within your very narrow sphere of interest in pattern quality at 50yd with TSS, I guess it'd be hard to say that a SBE3 is worth nearly $2K compared to a Stevens single shot at a 90% discount. However, I think most would say that it's an apples to orange comparison. This would be true not only in comparing the overall utility and versatility the guns regardless of game, but also differences when used exclusively for turkey.

Regarding the latter, I've found Benelli's with their chrome-lined bores foul less and will maintain pattern quality for more shots than regular barrels. Plus, when you do need to clean, it's a much easier task to boot. It's been my experience that regular bores may shoot great for a few shots with a bore snake down the tube in between, but will drop off in pattern quality pretty rapidly as the bore fouls. Some will find this a valuable feature, but others may not.

I have a little custom 28GA Contender and enjoy it immensely, so I'm not knocking single shots or regular bores. I'm just not getting why you think Benelli, Browning and others are having a hard time selling high-end semi-autos when that segment of the market obviously continues to grow rapidly.

[GLS]

Here are my single-shots that I have been successful with on birds or plan to take hunting. The total asking price on the guns was $465. All but the top gun were bought new from dealers. The top one is the most interesting. It was considered by Beretta to be its beginners gun. This 20 ga. Beretta 412 was made in 1954. It shoots Kyle Smith's load very well as shown by the link below. I hesitate to vandalize it by converting it to a sole purpose of turkey hunting. I've shot woodcock successfully with it using spreader loads. It shoots low off the bead. I've corrected this by attaching a small, but powerful magnet to the action's top which raises point of impact with the bead floating over the top of the centered magnet. I plan on shooting a 2.75" 1.25 oz. #7.5 copperplated lead load for turkeys. Gun is chambered at 2.75" and weighs 4 lbs. 13 oz. It is solidly built with 70 mm barrel (27.55") factory full. The pattern has a good density up to 30 yards with the center appearing as dense as the linked TSS Kyle Smith pattern at 40 yards. The gun below it is a Yildiz TK12 12 gauge. My preferred load is a brutal at both ends of the gun 1 3/8 oz. load of TSS. Gun weight, 4.25 lbs. with 24" from breech to end of choke.
Next is my Yildiz TK36 .410 with a 25" barrel. Between 3.25 to 3.5 lbs. Last but certainly a beast, is the Baikal MP18 20 ga. with 24" barrels.
5 lbs. 7 oz. I shoot Hal's original 1 5/8 oz. load in 3" hull. Link is for photos of woodcock and TSS pattern, 1 oz. Kyle Smith load.
https://www.gobblernation.com/phpBB3/vi ... 12#p145279

[Hoobilly]

I own cheap guns and I own expensive guns. They both serve a purpose

Seems like the cheap ones have more problems in the long run compared to expensive ones I own if used for waterfowl. However for turkey hunting obviously they don’t get the workout like from duck hunting or dove.

[GLS]

My first sbe in 1998 was defective and after the dealer experienced the problem he handed me another one to take home. Cost of a gun is no guarantee of reliability. Gil

[GLS]

Oh, painful memories of new guns and problems new out of the box. A new 28 ga. Ithaca M37 that had timing issue dumping rounds into action with follower not up jamming the action. Not a cheap gun. My 870 Supermag refusing to extract out of the box. Not a cheap gun either. Just cheaply made. An unsolicited offer by a generous member for his Flex hone resolved that issue. I had to send the Ithaca back to Ithaca for cure.

[GLS]

Dbl post

[Hognutz]

By and large, you get what you pay for. That pertains to most things. Most inexpensive guns will not hold a candle to a well made one. You don't see too many Yildiz's at the trap and skeet club.

[GLS]

By and large, you get what you pay for. That pertains to most things. Most inexpensive guns will not hold a candle to a well made one. You don't see too many Yildiz's at the trap and skeet club.

Have you seen the Protostar by Yildiz?
http://www.prostarshotguns.com/

[GLS]

And then there's "it's not the arrow but the Indian".
An old and battered Baikal single shot with electrical taped together gun.

[Hognutz]

I have not seen the protostar. I will read up on them. Nobody's saying you can't kill game with a $150 shotgun but maybe if it was a Benelli, you wouldn't need the electoral tape..

[GLS]

With my new SBE, my new Ithaca M37 28 ga. and new 870 SuperMag, all bought from dealers, $4000 NIB at today's prices, they all three were heavy single-shots on the first day fired but with far more moving parts than my dedicated single shots. The Remington and Ithaca had to have barrels removed to clear the chambers and jammed actions. The dealer took back the SBE and replaced it. At least duct tape solved the Chilean's issues with his gun. My Ithaca M37 28 ga. took months to be returned under warranty. One man at the factory was the 28 ga. specialist and he was on sick leave. Maybe I was just unlucky but based on my experience, money spent doesn't necessarily insure reliability. OMMV. Shoot what pleases you. I do. Gil

[Hognutz]

Ok Gil. Stick with your electrical tape. I'll stick with my Benellis.