Before Season...

[ole5beards]

To call or not to call...

I asked this question on another forum a few weeks ago and it seemed to spark a good bit of friendly debate. Since I'm from Alabama and this forum was an Alabama forum most of the answers were the same as mine. I have a feeling that a lot of guys from this area and state were all taught by an older man/mentor/relative who we would describe as "Old School", and calling to a bird before the season in their eyes is a big NO NO. So since this forum has a more diverse group I wanted to pose this same question to y'all.

Here's my take. I don't do it but I have in the past and got the info I was looking for by calling sparingly before the season. I choose not to do it for various reasons, and probably the biggest is self control. Im afraid once he gobbles at me my inner turkey calling demons will over take my mind and body and before you know it I've called up a hard gobling bird before the season!! And also I wanna keep the woods like I was taught, undisturbed before I get ready to pull the trigger. Now the times I would call before the season was never on the roost or even early morning. If I had to go scout a few different spots or the only time I could scout was mid day I might yelp a few times to try and find out where a bird might be. If I got a gobble I would ease out quietly knowing that there was a bird I'd revisit when the season was in. I don't think nah I know doing that did not hurt that or any birds in that area. But IMHO those that go out weeks or days before the season and call to a bird as if they were in a hunting situation are doing damage, again that's my opinion. There's much debate about a turkeys memory and just how smart a turkey really is. I'm sure that a bird could and would forget about an incident involving calling before the season but to me it's risky. Why educate one more than necessary. But as I see it a yelp or 2 here and there is doing no damage.

Now a story about calling aggressive before the season. Years back I scouted one morning with a buddy. It was the day before opening morning and the birds were hammering it. My buddy calls to this bird and gets him fired up, all of a sudden his gobbles get real close and I told him he was messing up, but it was too late. A few minutes later we saw the read head from about 150 yards away. We were standing right outside of the truck. I don't know if that bird saw us or the truck or both but he spooked. The next morning he goes back into this area and heard a few birds off in the distance but the bird from the morning before did not gobble. So in my eyes he did educate the bird to an extent, but not beyond killing.

I know birds putt at a lot in the woods, coyotes, Bobcats, hunters, and or vehicles. But I don't know if they can decipher each one as what they were or if they just assume they're all danger and putt to alarm others. I've seen birds putt at coyotes and never run off and minutes later go back to normal and gobble again. So that would tell me that their memory might not be the greatest. A lot of info I'd like to find out about their memory. I'm sure yall have your ways and or reasons for calling or not calling before the season, and Id like for yall to share your thoughts and experiences with it.

[davisd9]

My mentor told me not to do it. Never said why, but I am guessing it is the same reason as you stated, would not stop calling or would try to get closer so I could see him. He taught me to go into the woods preseason and be quiet and still, make it seem as if I was never there, which I was taught to hunt the same, as if I was never there.

[guesswho]

I call more before season than I do once it's open.

[turkey_slayer]

I call more before season than I do once it's open.

Same here. I like my turkeys more educated with a PhD in call shy. Must not be paying attention in class cause they still get killed

[ole5beards]

I call more before season than I do once it's open.

He's not lying

[blunderbuss]

When turkey were first reintroduced into WNY in the 1980's they spread like wildfire and every one with a shotgun became a turkey hunter and an expert at that.
Quickly their favorite technique became calling preseason. Birds I knew were there became nearly impossible to call in. Now that these instant wonders have gone on to better pursuits, birds are, IMHO, back to normal. With this experience I do not call preseason. Scout a lot, let the birds tell me if they are there.

[jakesdad]

I call before season quite often,just not into "range" so to speak. Ive had birds that were very eager come in after just one call during preseason. I just shut up,sit still,and watch em walk away. I subscribe to the Ray Eye school of "call shy"...........it doesnt exist. Turkeys call to each other constantly every day.If they became "call shy" they would die off. Im more of a they become people shy. I would recommend to someone if they wanted to call preseason,do so sparingly and try not to run off birds that may come to a call.

[Grumpy]

I doubt that a turkey has a memory to gather and store that kind of information.

[jakesdad]

I doubt that a turkey has a memory to gather and store that kind of information.

I agree 100%. Some people think they have a PhD in call recognition.....man vs turkey,if you even mention the subject of preseason calling.

[appalachianassassin]

I use only locator calls preseason. also, I only need to hear him gobble once(not 250 times) to know hes there.

[guesswho]

Some birds will tell you a lot from preseason calling. Others not so much. I give their eyes and ears a lot more credit than I do their brains. That's why I don't think I hurt my chances any by preseason calling. Also theres a big difference between doing some preseason calling vs. preseason scaring the crap out of one.

[timbrhuntr]

I did not have a mentor so I learned mostly by doing on my own. I find that a lot of the things that people tell you not too do are not always right. I have called in the preseason to birds but never from a position that I could be seen. I have also called to some birds during the season until I was out of breath and had them come in gobbling all the way. I found that at first I did not call enough and it took me a while to sort of figure out how much to call to a turkey. In your story I believe you said the bird saw you at your truck and spooked. I think that probably had more to do with it than just the calling. I sure hope to find out first hand how finicky those Alabama birds are though !

[ICDEDTURKES]

This is a question that goes hand and hand with this.. The biggest thing you see outside the call shy folks is that you do not want them coming and getting spooked.. I buy this but do not disagree with preseason calling that is tactful.

The 2nd thing you see folks mention as to why not to do it, is what if he comes in and there is no hen, if this process is repeated he will quit coming looking for the hen..

But really if you were to bury yourself in the leaves, call up birds and they never seen a hen or anything I do not believe in this theory either.. I would have to believe it happens all the time with birds, hen yelps, gobbler comes, hen went about her business and is no longer there. Just think how many birds each year are called too, never gobble, start to come as hunter moves off.

[pedro]

It is illegal to call using turkey calls three weeks before the opening day in Illinois.

[HuntnMa]

well I am glad I am not alone, lol.....I can't resist educating them ...

[Waddle Whacker]

I don't do it. I was taught not to. I think if done tactfully, it's fine....I just don't.

[ole5beards]

To clarify I'm not saying my buddy's calling spooked the turkey. I was saying that he heard calling and came in and saw us and that's what spooked him. IF you call up the same gobbler repeatedly and he never sees a hen any of the times then yes he would be a lil bit wiser. But like ICDEDTURKES said a hen yelps in the wild and a gobbler gobbles, he takes his sweet time and by the time he decides to come on she has left the area, and he keeps gobbling as if nothing was wrong, happens quite a bit I'm sure. Especially with gobblers that have a big harem of hens.

Here's a scenario and I'm sure we've all done it. It's mid day you're out hunting and you hear nothing. So you sit down in an area known to have birds. You set up in some big open hardwoods early in the season where you can see a decent way and call about every 15 min or so. After a few series you get ready to call again and right when you start calling unbeknownst to you a silent gobbler has snuck within 100 yards and is just behind some trees and you never saw him. He putts, head bobs, and then runs off putting. Now your calling wasn't loud and proud it was soft and subtle, what spooked him? I'd guess the fact that he heard calling and knew he should be able to see a hen and he didn't. I know it's not the same as the other argument but isn't it similar? Also even though he walked away putting he isn't unkillable.

[guesswho]

If he ran off putting he's convinced there was danger. If he walks off putting he not so sure. Kind of like when a deer gives you the feeding head bob. That bird that walked away putting will probably be callable in 30 minutes from another spot. The one that ran off, well you might want to give him a while.

[drenalinld]

The mystique and legend old timers give turkeys is fun and makes great stories but is a heap of hockey. Gobblers may or may not gobble in the same spot on consecutive mornings so not hearing a bird the morning after he spooked from you and the truck really means little. If a bird did gobble there it might not have been the same one. I subscribe to the "call shy" or "educated birds" theories being rubbish. Birds habits can be altered if they constantly encounter perceived danger, but what most perceive as call shy is just normal progression of breeding cycle in my opinion and would be similar if there was little hunting pressure. If he has gurrels (I wish I could pronounce it like Tom Kelly) on the brain and gets the hell spooked out of him he may take a bit to get back in the mood.

In the second scenario, if you can see him, he can definitely see you. I have an old school uncle who told me when I described a similar scenario. "Why would you call with a gobbler looking at you, he can see you're not a hen dummy!" I do believe it's a bad idea to call when a gobbler can see you.

[blunderbuss]

We're going against nature trying to bring the tom to the hen. I believe when we do bring one in and he doesn't see the hen he gets nervous. I've seen it too many times. Calling them in before the season makes them hesitant to come in, not that they remember the call.

[ole5beards]

The 2nd scenario was about a gobbler that you did NOT see that snuck in silently.

[ICDEDTURKES]

Here's a scenario and I'm sure we've all done it. It's mid day you're out hunting and you hear nothing. So you sit down in an area known to have birds. You set up in some big open hardwoods early in the season where you can see a decent way and call about every 15 min or so. After a few series you get ready to call again and right when you start calling unbeknownst to you a silent gobbler has snuck within 100 yards and is just behind some trees and you never saw him. He putts, head bobs, and then runs off putting. Now your calling wasn't loud and proud it was soft and subtle, what spooked him? I'd guess the fact that he heard calling and knew he should be able to see a hen and he didn't. I know it's not the same as the other argument but isn't it similar? Also even though he walked away putting he isn't unkillable.

I have seen this.. It is similar in the fact he expects a hen to be there but your scenario involves actually calling while a bird is what in range of what they believe they should have visual confirmation and my scenario is he arrives and sees nor hears anything. But your question raises more questions.. This gobbler was hid behind a tree or the trees obscured your ability to see him sneak in.. So wouldn't it be just as likely seeings you are most likely sitting against a tree that the gobblers perception would be you were on the back side of the tree as well thus he cannot see the hen.. What about all the gobblers killed in open hardwoods each year you know are coming where some soft yelps or clucks are needed either know you see him to finish him or direct him while he is in your visual.

We all like to think we sit still all the time I can assure you I sit "still" but am by no means a statue.. I recall the late Lovett Williams saying a turkey cannot recognize the human form without movement. You gotta figure about every call we use their is movement involved, box-yes, pot-yes, tube-yes, trumpet-yes and even a diaphragm I move my hand to my mouth most times as for cutting I use back pressure and even yelping the hand seems to add consistency.. There is no telling how long that gobbler is standing in said spot and with their ability to course a spot through calling how long he has been burning a hole in you and the movement from calling does not exactly scare him but lets him know he has seen something that alarms him.

[Greyghost]

Well, I may be full of hockey, but:

I am old school maybe even pre-school. But that term gets me chuckling some. To me yesterday was old school.

But back in the days it was not "old school" but a hunting style used for the given conditions/situations. Just like today.

Back then few birds, no publications, videos computers and all on how to. It was all pretty much self taught. So every thing was sorta slow motions and eased into doing this or that. Yea Mchilhanny, Turpin, Everett and Davis had their books but again not much info.

Shot till about 1967 I knew of only about 5 turkey hunters and with the exception of my grandfather they came off of no info.

But from my perspective, today if one wants to pre season call, go for it. I personally do not. I too do not buy the call shy bird thing. I believe in hunting pressure or human shy.

Let me regress back a few years when I started. Me and my grandfather in hunting the fall birds before there was a spring season would walk sometimes for 3 days or so before even finding any sign. Even the first spring season in 1968 it was a good day if you heard a gobble. So with that I was brought up to hunt turkeys with a call and gun on opening day. But scout pre-season locating the area they were in and trying to keep them located till opening day.

Well birds have exploded since the 50 and 60's especially after 70. Today we are blessed with lots of those feathered birds. Today even if one does not work out or is messed up you can go after that 2nd and 3rd bird the same day. So today new styles have developed and those hunting turkeys since the great explosions do find old styles amusing. Yes even me. But remember one day depending on how we maintain our habitat and turkey populations and calling/hunting evolves I am sure folks will be chuckling at the styles we are using today.

Disclamer for below ( hunt hunt mostly public land, military bases)

Today over the last few years I am noticing less turkey talk. (could be my hearing) Even in the fall after a great bust the birds seem not be be regrouping as fast or in the same place as the bust. Along with very little talking. Now true most fall seasons come in after bow season/small game in most states and the turkeys have been busted out of roost by other hunters small game or whoever. Also most of the day with scouters or predators.
So many variables there.

But in the spring season it seems less gobbling and better responses using gobbler yelps and clucks or just hen clucks.

[Jaybird]

I have always called on scouting trips, especially when I have multiple public areas to check out, not close to home. I will use my box call to cover as much area as possible. If I know the area, I generally don't call at all. Has worked well for me, and I never got busted. Had to hide a couple of times until the bird left, but those were rare incidents. Started doing this way before I learned it was a no no, but never saw a reason to stop.