Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

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Reloader
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Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Reloader »

It continues to amaze me how many folks you hear talk about how bad lead #6s are for turkey hunting. I just don't get it and I'm very passionate about this hobby as well as handloading. When I started turkey hunting we'd just set a coke can on the ground at various ranges and blast away with our favorite scatter gun. If you put 10 or 15 pellets in the can, no turkey stood a chance :D The old timers seemed to have the opinion that 4s were the best thing going, but you'd be lucky to get one pellet in a can where #6s would riddle them. So 6s it was. I later became interested in patterning guns with various loads and various chokes, even moved up to shooting paper targets that had turkey heads on them. If I put 10 or 12+ pellets in the head, I was cooking with Crisco. Again, #6s always took the victory, so that's what I hunted. My first "good" patterning rig could accomplish that task with 3" Winchester lead #6s out to 50yds. I knew no different, 6s proved to be the winner every time. The funny thing is I killed a pile of toms with 6s, never had a problem with crippling birds. Many of those birds were out at that 50yd mark + or - a couple yards. Again, none ever took flight. Then, there's a couple poorly misjudged birds along the way out past 50yds and yep, those inferior 6s killed them stone dead. Pure lucky pellets I suppose. I really couldn't tell you how many birds I've killed with lead 6s, but it's more than enough to know for a fact that they are indeed deadly turkey fodder in range tested set-ups. So, to the point of the story, I just don't see the reasoning behind the myth that 6s are a poor choice when it comes to turkey hunting. I personally feel it has far more to do with guys shooting birds at much further ranges than their gun is set up for, guys not knowing their POI, guys getting those lucky one pellet hits with larger shot....basically guys just not knowing their equipment.

I fully admit that I'm eat up with this stuff, I'm a passionate handloader and love to come up with loads and gun/choke combos that take things to extreme limits. For those reasons I no longer use my beloved lead #6s, but I darn sure know that they are fully capable for turkey hunting out to ranges where the pattern density holds. I also realize one needs to run the combo that suits his style of hunting best. There's a give and take to long range set-ups, a comprise in close range pattern size is a good example. I personally like to kill my birds in the 25-35yd range and do so more times than not, but I'll take one at 60yds in a second if given the chance. I spend too much time and money chasing these rascals to let one pass me by if they hang up at a range I know my equipment will perform. If that's not your cup of tea, I'm cool with that as well. I like shooting them with smaller ga guns or archery tackle at times as well and fully understand the sense of accomplishment for those challenges.

Anyone else feel the same as me about good ole #6 lead?

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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by redarrow »

There was a time that I used Fed. copper plated 6s.That's what was shooting when I shot my first turkey at 63 paces. 1 or maybe 2 pellets in the head.Shooting at turkey targets at 25 - 30 yards I was putting 6 0r 8 pellets in the brain and neckbone and that was awesome to me. Then I was educated to Nitro's.I was hooked on them. Stretched out to forty yards they were pure death. Now with TSS as far as i'm concerned I will save my lead shells for squirrels. Not because they won't kill turkeys cause they will. But i'm a TSS junkie now.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by MKW »

It will take MANY, MANY years for HTL to catch up with lead in number of turkey deaths. Ain't nothing wrong with lead 6s for killing turkeys...and they will kill them farther than anyone should be shooting at them.

Mike
Last edited by MKW on February 27th, 2014, 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by turkey_slayer »

I started out with 5s then switched to 6s. I liked em but the turkeys didn't. Not a thing wrong with lead
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by blunderbuss »

Sorry, not my experience with lead, can't beat the ballistics of 18gmc3. :thumbleft:
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Stinky J Picklestein »

Hell, I went down to #7.5's, and they worked fine, too. ;)
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Reloader »

MKW wrote:It will take MANY, MANY years for HTL to catch up with lead in number of turkey deaths. Ain't nothing wrong with lead 6s for killing turkeys...and they will kill them farther than anyone should be shooting at them.

Mike
Preach on brother!
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Reloader »

Stinky J Picklestein wrote:Hell, I went down to #7.5's, and they worked fine, too. ;)
LOL, I don't doubt it a bit.

It's funny you mention it as I set up my 9yo nephew with one of my 12ga turkey rigs shooting 1-1/8oz #7.5 quail loads. The Rhino .660 throws a nice even pattern with them out to 35yds. Too bad they might bounce off their noggin :D
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by hawglips »

Since Winchester discontinued their XRHD stuff and replaced it with the very innovative lead Longbeards, the gap between lead and HTL turkey deaths is going to widen some more!

But I personally quit #6 lead when I saw how much better hevishot was at putting them down cold. And I don't chase near as many down, or step on near as many necks since I left the lead 6s for better stuff.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Reloader »

hawglips wrote:Since Winchester discontinued their XRHD stuff and replaced it with the very innovative lead Longbeards, the gap between lead and HTL turkey deaths is going to widen some more!

But I personally quit #6 lead when I saw how much better hevishot was at putting them down cold. And I don't chase near as many down, or step on near as many necks since I left the lead 6s for better stuff.
The modern HTL variety has certainly allowed us to put far more holes in their noggins.

I agree with you on the new Wins. I thought I was on to something when I finally came up with lead handloads that would do 160s at 40, LOL.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by ICDEDTURKES »

Reloader wrote:
hawglips wrote:I thought I was on to something when I finally came up with lead handloads that would do 160s at 40, LOL.
I have shot Hevi shot since it debuted in a 2 3/4 1 5/8 predecessor to Old white.. It was not the lure of extra penetration it was the ease of getting acceptable patterns.. Our stash of activs was running dry and countless choke tubes and lead loads later there was nothing capable of what we were getting with the Activs.. Thus Hevi shot made everything easier..

Until this year with the lead loads we had available it was a very difficult task to get a gun to shoot 140-150 type patterns with lead.. Required shooting numerous chokes and loads and invest alot of money and you may not even sniff those types of numbers..

I have not shot a 12 gauge at a turkey 6 or 7 years but I have a few guns that are getting converted to lead and I may punch a noggin with one this year..
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Reloader »

Those old Hevis darn sure did make things easier. Those OWs were some goodies as well, you could shoot an old white in darn near any turkey choke and have ridiculous patterns compared to lead. I remember when I shot a couple that went in the 240 range and just couldn't believe it. I probably have 15-20 boxes of the old whites hanging around(And no, they are not for sale :D ). Good times.

Who would have ever thought we'd start seeing patterns of 300+ with factory fodder. Not to mention over 200 with factory lead!
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Shooter »

Yep, started out loading Copper 4s I don't how long ago. Then started shooting 10s with copper 2s,..lol. Then they outlawed 2s. Back to 4s. Then I started shootin copper 5s just to get more pellets. They did so well, went to copper 6s. They did so well, I got tired of luggin that cross tie around, and went back to a 12 with the 6s. When Hevishot came out at $89 for a 7lb bag, tried them out, and the rest is history.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Hoobilly »

Reloader wrote:
Who would have ever thought we'd start seeing patterns of 300+ with factory fodder. Not to mention over 200 with factory lead!
that right there blows my mind.

if you would have told me this last year, I would have laughed at you.
amazing what can happen with a turkey load


I hope they do this for waterfowl loads..
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by ICDEDTURKES »

hoobilly wrote:
I hope they do this for waterfowl loads..
I had a thread in the gun section that sort of addressed this.. They claim the patterns and penetration is simply from pellet deformation in previous lead loads.. If that is not entirely the case and the resin does more with the number of waterfowl loads burned up each fall vs the turkey loads in the spring we are gonna see it with steel..

Waterfowlers are at least as ate up with long range gunning as turkey hunters and if not even a "snow goose" load in a season that is viewed more as war than hunting and keeps costs down it will sell.. Will be interesting to see where we go..
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by appalachianassassin »

I shoot lead #6 and have since I started turkey hunting. shot the hevis for a couple years and they just got too expensive. most my turkeys are within 20 yds but ill kill em every time at 60 and flat crush em at 50.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by pedro »

appalachianassassin wrote:I shoot lead #6 and have since I started turkey hunting. shot the hevis for a couple years and they just got too expensive. most my turkeys are within 20 yds but ill kill em every time at 60 and flat crush em at 50.
Every time @60?! Wow, you must have one nice shooting scatter gun. What kind of patterns are you getting at that distance?
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Spuriosity »

pedro wrote:
appalachianassassin wrote:I shoot lead #6 and have since I started turkey hunting. shot the hevis for a couple years and they just got too expensive. most my turkeys are within 20 yds but ill kill em every time at 60 and flat crush em at 50.
Every time @60?! Wow, you must have one nice shooting scatter gun. What kind of patterns are you getting at that distance?
I agree and would love to see a pattern pic shot at 60 yds. Prior to the introduction of Winch LBs it was nearly impossible to get a sure kill 100/10" pattern with lead beyond 45 yds. At 60 it would be tough to do better than 50/10". That will kill one "sometimes" with a lucky pellet or two, but not "every time".
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by DC1. »

pedro wrote:
appalachianassassin wrote:I shoot lead #6 and have since I started turkey hunting. shot the hevis for a couple years and they just got too expensive. most my turkeys are within 20 yds but ill kill em every time at 60 and flat crush em at 50.
Every time @60?! Wow, you must have one nice shooting scatter gun. What kind of patterns are you getting at that distance?
Makes me think of a article I read years ago, the guy said, a size 9 boot has "killed" way more gobblers than anybody will ever know !
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by hawglips »

appalachianassassin wrote:I shoot lead #6 and have since I started turkey hunting. shot the hevis for a couple years and they just got too expensive. most my turkeys are within 20 yds but ill kill em every time at 60 and flat crush em at 50.
I've never seen a 60 yd lead shell pattern in any shot size, so I'd also be interested to see the pattern you're getting.

If one ever gets within 20 yds of me, I made a mistake somewhere....
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by turkey_slayer »

DC1. wrote:
pedro wrote:
appalachianassassin wrote:I shoot lead #6 and have since I started turkey hunting. shot the hevis for a couple years and they just got too expensive. most my turkeys are within 20 yds but ill kill em every time at 60 and flat crush em at 50.
Every time @60?! Wow, you must have one nice shooting scatter gun. What kind of patterns are you getting at that distance?
Makes me think of a article I read years ago, the guy said, a size 9 boot has "killed" way more gobblers than anybody will ever know !
Lol true. I killed a few a fuzz over 50. This was before anyone ever patterned and everyone I shot I had to put the boot on the head. Only thing that one pellet did was stun em enough for me to run up to em. I remember a lot of the old timers using 10 gauges so they could extend there range. Not all old timers followed the under 40 "rule" :roll:
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Hoobilly »

ICDEDTURKES wrote:
hoobilly wrote:
I hope they do this for waterfowl loads..
I had a thread in the gun section that sort of addressed this.. They claim the patterns and penetration is simply from pellet deformation in previous lead loads.. If that is not entirely the case and the resin does more with the number of waterfowl loads burned up each fall vs the turkey loads in the spring we are gonna see it with steel..

Waterfowlers are at least as ate up with long range gunning as turkey hunters and if not even a "snow goose" load in a season that is viewed more as war than hunting and keeps costs down it will sell.. Will be interesting to see where we go..
they need to try it and I hope it works wonders
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Waddle Whacker »

I shot lead 6's until about 7-8 years ago. I believe it was the last bird I killed with lead, that was at 47 steps and acted like he had been hit with T9's at 30 yards. I'll never forget that bird, didn't even twitch....musta been a magic shell, crazy. Stretched out and shot another at 52, he was still very spry upon my arrival. He just kinda sat down when I shot, looked like he was gonna lay an egg or something. Can't recall if I had to put another one in him or if I pounced. Pretty bad misjudgement on that one, field bird. Those were my 2 furthest kills with lead 6's, but I stacked em up inside 45 for quite a few years. Now I'm a TSS guy all the way.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by Shooter »

Lead has been funny with me through the years. Sometimes I killed them dead as a doornail, sometimes I had to run them down, and sometimes they got away. HTL just seems to KILL them!
35yds in, lead works like a champ with pretty much any shot size.
I remember a big Gobbler I shot with the 10, at 45yds, years ago. Handloaded 2 1/4oz of copper 4s. After he runs off like nothing came out, I go over to the spot he was, and feathers were everywhere. I hunted for that bird half a day and never found anything.
I'm still scratchin my head on that one!!!
I guess what i'm saying is, when you shoot lead at 50, 60, or more,... it is a crap shoot whether you are gonna bring that bird home or not.
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Re: Inferior Lead #6s, LOL.....

Post by GLS »

About 30 years ago John McDaniel published his experiments with lead 6's. He set up targets in full open field and in a turkey woods with bush and small stickups between the target and gun--what he said in his experience were legitimate turkey shots. He stopped using 6's when he eyeballed poorer, sketchy patterns due to pellet deflection on the hunting scenario patterns compared with that on the open field. His conclusion was that 6's were easily deflected by light screening between bird and gun and that rarely was a woods pathway clean.
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